For the Dutch gamers going to TERA!

by Braintwo, 41 days ago

Look at: dutchbasterds.guildlaunch.com

Join us in the world of Tera!
See you soon! ;)

Loot Rules

by eallera, 56 days ago

Loot rules

It seems there is always a problem with distributing loot. Its a common and well know problem in lots of guild. I have been asked to come up with some ideas for a loot system that works for the guild. There already been post on the MIB forums about the loot rules.

"First of all, you can roll on items for you main spec.
If you win an item once, you have to pass on the next rolls until all raid members of your
class have looted an item. Then loot rolling is reset and all can loot again
If all decide to pass, everyone can roll for the item. This means for your off spec
or even if it isn't for your class... eg. clerics rolling on mage rings.
Last but not least don't roll on items for fun, so make sure it is an upgrade for you.
If need be we will ask a class leader to make an objective opinion on this subject.
If after that it isn't an upgrade for noone we will rune break the item and it goes to the guildbank . We hope this loot system makes thing honest and gives all players a chance on some nice loot"

And

"This is the most sensitive matter for all. And we want to keep it fair for as many players as possible, but know that, all loot that we get should be given to players who will make absolute use of it and will help the guild progress. So I came up with a model:

T2 raider main spec > T1 raider main spec > T2 raider off spec > T1 raider off spec > PUGS."

And a system with new guild ranks has been added. We got t1 and t2 raiders and all are expected to know what to do.
So how do we proceed from this point. Is the loot/ raid system as mentioned above this still fair and valid. After some searching on the internet there seems to be a wide variety of loot systems, after some copy, paste and rewriting i came up with.

Besides the options mentioned above we also can use a point system called DKP ( thanks bloodline).
It will look approximately like this:

A) GAINING POINTS:
- You gain points for a variety of things while raiding. Attendance bonuses are awarded to those that are ON TIME, and ready to go at the raid start time. This does not mean that at raid start time you are gathering your materials, it means you are ready to take the port at the given time. You also cannot leave early unexpectedly, or you lose your attendance bonus. All other point earnings are unaffected by leaving early (meaning you still get credit for what you contribute to).
- Each Boss kill nets you points, with extra points for downing the last boss.
- Each guild first boss kill will net you bonus points.
- You are awarded points for the raid AFTER the raid concludes. Points earned during a raid cannot be used to roll on loot during that raid.
- You can accumulate a maximum of 200 points (this works out to earning EVERY point you can for approximately three raids).

Points are awarded as follows:

20 Points – Attendance bonus
10 Points – Per boss killed
20 Points – Per end boss killed
10 Points – Bonus per guild first boss kill

B) SPENDING POINTS:
- If you wish to gain a piece of loot, you will be rolling with 100 points + your accumulated point total. You must add your ENTIRE point total to the roll. If you win the roll you spend all of your points. For example, if a person with NO POINTS wants to roll on a piece of gear against a person with the cap of 200 POINTS, it would be “/roll 100″ vs a “/roll 300″. The person at cap will have a 3x better chance to win the gear.
- Truly LEGENDARY items (items tiered HIGHER than purples like orange weapons, etc.) may only be rolled on if you have accumulated points. This means nobody rolling a /100 can roll on these items.

C) WAIT LIST:
Anyone on wait list, that is on time, ready to go, and on standby throughout raid receives full raid points. Folks on the wait list will be asked to check-in at all boss kills. If you need to AFK (5-15 mins) shoot a tell to the attendance officer. It is strongly encouraged that those folks waiting should try to group up and get gear via dungeons.

D) ATTENDANCE POLICY:
- If you show up for the raid without being signed up you will receive NO POINTS FOR THE RAID. Placing of players that have not signed up at http://meninblack.guildlaunch.com in the RAID section will be a LOW PRIORITY (even if better geared).
- If you are placed in a raid without being signed up you will be able to roll on loot and spend any previously accumulated points. This means if you even THINK you might make it, go sign up under the wait list to avoid being penalized.
- When you sign-up, if there is a possibility of you being late or having to leave early please leave a comment stating so.
- Unexpectedly Leaving early without communicating a legitimate reason to the attendance officer forfeits Attendance Bonus (20 pts), all other points earned are retained.

E) ALTS
It is expected of every member to gear their main character prior to any alts. If your alt is brought on a raid, main characters will always be geared prior to alts. Only after loot is passed on by all the main characters present may an alt attempt to roll on loot. In a circumstance where loot drops that is not bound in any way, main characters CANNOT roll in order to give it to an alt. An alt may however roll to give loot to a main. Each member can only have one main character.


Also we have a option to make a loot council (thanks elysium)
It will look approximately like this:

What this means is simply:

1.) There is always ONLY ONE Loot-Master(Class Exempt), Along with 1(one) Ranking officer of each class on the council.

2.) All loot will be posted, per boss, for all participants to view before rolling begins.

3.) Each Raid/Group participant may roll main spec on any gear. However, once they have won an item they will not be eligable to win another MS item roll over someone who has not yet won a MS item. (See Rule 10 for more information)

4.) Main Spec /roll is of higher importance than Off-Spec /roll.

5.) After all loot is posted, a 30 second Time will commence, and Main Spec rolling will begin. (Each /roll will reset the timer to 1minute)**

6.) At the end of the 30 seconds Main Spec Roll duration, If there are no rolls, Main Spec Rolling will be closed and it will then be opened up to the next tier of rolling.

7.) If there is a Draw, each Tied participant may choose to PASS or Re-Roll.

8.) Any player may willingly pass their roll at anytime.

9.) Raiders on Probation may NOT roll on loot until they have ended their probation

10.) Raiders with lower than t1 rank may NOT win loot over participants with "Raider" rank or higher. If no "Raider" rank or higher rolls for Main Spec occur it will be opened to all.

All Raiders MUST keep RAID CHAT clear during /roll procedures!

THE COUNCIL WILL ULTIMATELY DECIDE WHO SHALL BE AWARDED LOOT


Than we have EPGP (thanks offline)
It looks approximately like this:

Introduction to EPGP
EP stands for Effort points and GP stands for Gear Points, together these are divided to equal a PR(Priority) for each person in the guild that is actively raiding/signing up for raids.

It is designed to award players for being active within the guild and is basically a MS or OS loot system.

Index

1. EP(Effort points)

2. GP(Gear/Gain points)

3. PR(Priority) & Decay

4. Loot policy


1. EP(Effort Points)

Effort points are given out to raid members of the guild for any of the activities below:

For Signing up and being on time for the raid, being on TS and being prepared with Vials/Full Planar Charge.

Every hour starting from the first pull in our raid you will be given a specific sum of points.

For regular boss kills.

For Killing new bosses that we have not killed before.

To be eligible for loot, there is a minimum EP requirement that new members or members that have just started raiding have to reach to be eligible to loot items.

It is there to prevent new people from joining and instantly taking items over our current active members, this also acts like a trial period for the new member to see if they are active and good for the guild.

If you have signed up to a raid as available and are on time, but could not join it due to it being full, you are allowed to be on standby during the duration of the raid and still recieve EP for being available. The amount awarded will be at the discretion of the GM/Officers in all circumstances.

To be eligible for this, you need to be ready to join the raid at any given moment, and should also be available on ts.

If you sign up for a Raid as available and are not available for invites, you will receive negative EP. So please make sure you only sign as available if you will be on time.

People who sign as Available will receive priority for invites over people who sign up as Tentative.

If you need to leave the raid early, make sure your Raid Leader knows beforehand (Or leave a note with Tentative sign up). If you leave before the end of raid time you may lose EP. This will be at the Raid Leaders' Discretion.


2. GP(Gear/Gain Points)

Gear points is something you gain by looting items.

Currently we have a Base GP of 100 that everyone has to prevent infinite Priority.

The cost of items have already been decided and are in the following categories;

2H Weapons
1H Weapons/Shield & Offhand
Chest, Legs, Head, Hands
Shoulders, Feet, Waist, Trinket
Accessories, (Rings & Necklaces)
Hexed Items
Relics

Note: MS items will be looted at full GP cost, while OS items will only be looted at half the normal GP cost.

In these categories we have tried to consider everything, slot space, amount of stats, what use they have for each class etc.


3. PR(Priority) & Decay

PR is calculated by dividing EP / GP, If you raid and don't loot, your PR will go up and you will have Priority over any other member of your class to loot the first item that drops that you want.

When you take that first item and gain GP for looting it, your PR will drop and you will have less priority over other members, after that you will have to raid to get your PR up again to have first priority on loot specific for your class.

Decay is something that will happen at the start of every raid. Every member that has raided and gained any points will have their EP and GP decay by a percentage. This is to prevent people from hoarding points.


4. Loot policy

Our guild's loot rules are as follows;
Main role/Main stat Priority will be taken into consideration at all times, therefore it is important that you let us know what your Main role is. Unless requested by Raid Leader, you will not recieve any EP for bringing an ALT or be eligible to roll for loot over any main character.

It is MS or OS, the raid leader will announce the item in this manner for example;

Dagger of pro imbaness MS.

If people need it, they may reply in raid chat;

"Need"

and if no one needs it the raid leader will announce it again as follows;

Dagger of pro imbaness OS.

You will have a chance to need it for your OS at half of the normal GP cost of the item.

If no one still needs it, it will be runebroken and mats will be donated to the guild bank.

For new members there are specific loot rules, they can of course not loot anything before they reach the minimum amount of EP required to be eligible for loot unless any Core Member does not need it.

Main stat prio is of course always going to be there, a cleric will have priority over a mage if the item has high wisdom and vice versa.


Another option is GDKP (based on wow but principle keeps the same)
It will look approximately like this

GDKP Basics
GDKP is essentially a bidding system for gear that drops in much the same way as DKP or EP/GP functions. However, instead of players using points to bid on items they bid with gold. The highest bidder gets the item, the rest of the players in the raid split the gold, so everyone gets something. There is a great historical post over on the Elitist Jerk’s page that gives all the details, it can be found here: GDKP Run Discussion: Spread it to your Server.


Straight from Tyrain’s excellent post on the subject of GDKP runs, here are the “in a nutshell” rules for GDKP.
1. GDKP stands for "Gold-DKP". It can also be known by similar names such as "Gold runs", "GKP runs", or "Cash runs".
2. It was a Korean concept brought to WoW. It's already established and extremely common in some regions, only recently introduced on some servers, yet still completely unheard of on others.
3. Items which drop in your run are auctioned off in raid chat. The highest bidder receives the item and the gold they pay is added to "The Pot"
4. Profession Patterns, BoE's, Crusader Orbs, Disenchanted Shards etc are all auctioned off in this manner as well. Basically everything that drops.
5. "The Pot" keeps growing in value until the end of the run
6. "The Pot" is split evenly at the end of the run to all 25 players in the raid present when the final boss dies. Everyone gets an equal share.
7. There is no mainspec > offspec priority, it’s gold which determines who gets what.

GDKP Theory
The theory behind GDKP is that many players that raid simply get boarded of running content that they can beat easily so never run it again. On the flip side, there are players that really want to run the content and get the gear but don’t have enough gear to allow them to be in there. Something they do have, or can very easily get, is gold. In today’s game it is nothing for players to farm for a day and earn 5-10,000 gold in 8-10 hours of play time.
GDKP tries to team players that are either very over geared, or have lots of gold to spend on gear together. Ideally in a 25 player raid you want to have about 10 that are way over geared for the content and need nothing, 10 that need a lot of gear and have lots of gold, and 5 that are there for just 1 or 2 specific pieces that they never got to drop, but are otherwise geared.


The last i want to mention is Suicide Kings
it will look approximately like this

SUICIDE KINGs

Suicide Kings is a priority loot distribution system for guild raiding. It is the lowest form of DKP, and is designed for casual raiding, yet allowing the hardcore raiders to continuously progress.

How to run Suicide Kings:

1. Players are put into an ordered list. The following are a few prospective ideas on how to designate the primary Loot List.

a. Since it is our desire to protect some of the better geared players who have invested more time into the guild they should be placed higher in the list.

b. Alternatively, random rolls can be taken to find your position in the list.

c. Should a new person ever need to be added they will be inserted into the bottom of the list.


2.. When loot drops the person who wants the loot, and is highest on the list receives the loot. Once the person receives the loot their name goes to the bottom of the list

a. This is where the name suicide kings originated. When you are at the top of the list nothing can stop you from receiving the gear, but in taking the gear you suicide your king to the bottom of the list.

b. If the person at the top passes, the second person will have a chance to take the gear, and the gear will be passed down the ladder until someone takes the piece.


Common Complaints about Suicide Kings (specifically related to the guild):


1. If there is one master list people can roll on any gear they want to wear.

a. To maintain order with respect to people rolling on one spec we can create sub lists or “tiers” in place within the master list. You will be placed in a list based on your declared main spec. This main spec should suit both the player and the raid together.

I. Common example: Clerics are sitting on three vital positions. Offtank, Heals, DPS. We all recognize that there is specific gear to fit all three slots. Easiest form to combat the “issue” is as follows:

---- Main Heal Group Specified by the main 5 Healers. They are considered in Tier 1 of Heals. Then, your second set of Healers would be in a Tier 2. If the item up for grabs has been issued to all preset Tier 1 members, Tier 2 is now given the same Suicide King option.

II. The other major issue revolves around tanking. The fix is simple as well: The guild has members who have stepped forward to tank in Raids. These members are in a side record and have primary loot on the tank gear. However, these members are also apart of other very unique roles such as DPS or Heals. This is the role where they would utilize there Suicide Kings position. Tanking is simply a side record with a primary getting first time through, and then having a secondary. This is in the best interest of everyone who raids because we need fully geared tanks to keep us all alive!


2. What if one person knows they are the only person that can use a certain piece of gear, and refuses to suicide their king.

a. We have the ability to declare before the raid a one or two piece free loot if only one person in the raid can use a piece before “suiciding” their king.

b. All in all, the ability to declare any rule specified on this issue is available. To allow a 100% “free will” system, if the item passes through all the people in the respected list, the item can then be rolled on by that group. This still remains fair because everyone has equal opportunity to take the item prior to randomized rolls. Also, this is where the Ladies and Gentleman are separated from the little boys and girls. Appreciation for people needing the gear more than others and with the consent of all people in the respected list can simply agree to assign it without Suiciding.


Also see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHaKTQ-g9y4 for some video explanation


Here some pro and cons for the different loot systems

Random Roll
Pro: It's completely fair to everyone.
Con: it is the worst way to get up an entire raid efficiently. Doing it this way will normally put all the gear on the lucky guy.

Dragon Kill Points (DKP)
Pro: Each member knows what their score is. When a loot item drops they spend the point to buy the item. Awards items to the person that has been there the longest.
Con: Requires a tracking method that sometimes means complex adjustments on a website. Frequently is unbalanced toward the people that have been there the longest. Ripe for abuse by elder players that don't want other people to have gear. Awarding too many points will result in a seriously unbalanced loot system
Loot Council
Pros: Most efficient way to gear up a raid, very little outside maintenance required by council.
Cons: Requires Council to be unbiased, requires council to understand class mechanics, decisions will be questioned frequently if they appear to be done with bias.

Effort points and gear points (EPGP)
Pro: Awards attendance, Known amount of points used to buy items. Purchases zero sum back into the pool allowing other raid members to buy items
Cons: Extremely time intensive to track

Gold Dragon Kill Points (GDKP)
Pros: All loot is available to every character, good way to make in game money
Cons: Completely mercenary in nature, person with the most gold wins item, corrupt loot auctioneer can result in loss of gold

Suicide Kings
Pros: Round robin loot distribution, fair per class
Cons: Requires maintaining a loot list, Can sometimes award upgrades in odd manner


Its a lot of information to process and some of systems will not work for our guild. Because they are time consuming and will not fit in a casual guild or benefits the one with the most money
The big question is what will work for our guild. Before i make my suggestion. There is something else i want to point out, because its related to the loot system.
Which loot system you use depends on how you raid and with who.
I think its wise to have a main group for HK raiding a dedicated team which want to make progress, eager, willing to put the bar a step higher, committed to the raid and guild.
All said and done (keeping in mind the things i said before) and after some more reading i think there are 2 systems that will work.

1. Loot Council
2. Suicide Kings
(backup plan is dkp)

Now its up to you to decide which system works for you.
Think we need some democratic vote system here.
Just let me know.

btw English is not my native language so my apology's for any errors in the tekst

Eallera

Sigils and stuff

by Teratrixxx, 64 days ago

Dear MiB raiders,

We will soon be needing Water and Earth resistance sigels. Please get the Water one ASAP, you still got plenty of time to prepare the Earth.

Also, I ask that you read up on HK bosses and come prepared for the next week, because we have a lot of bosses to clear and we need to have progress on Molinar too. We lose too much time clearing farm bosses and wiping because people simply haven't read up on bosses.

I hope you understand...

Here's the link to RiftStrats' Molinar guide:
http://www.riftstrats.com/hammerknell-fortress/king-molinar-and-prince-dollin/

And here's the link to a fun video regarding Rift in 2012:
http://eu.riftgame.com/en/media/videos/anniversary/